Journals of the Senate
53 Elizabeth II, A.D. 2004, Canada
Journals of the Senate
3rd Session, 37th Parliament
Issue 8
Friday, February 13, 2004
9:00 a.m.
The Honourable Daniel Hays, Speaker
The Members convened were:
The Honourable Senators
Adams, Andreychuk, Angus, Atkins, Austin, Bacon, Banks, Biron, Callbeck, Carstairs, Chaput, Christensen, Cochrane, Cook, Cools, Corbin, Cordy, Doody, Downe, Gauthier, Graham, Harb, Hays, Jaffer, Kelleher, Kinsella, Lapointe, LeBreton, Léger, Losier-Cool, Lynch-Staunton, Maheu, Mahovlich, Mercer, Milne, Moore, Morin, Munson, Murray, Pépin, Phalen, Poulin (Charette), Poy, Prud'homme, Ringuette, Robichaud, Rompkey, Smith, Stratton
The Members in attendance to business were:
The Honourable Senators
Adams, Andreychuk, Angus, Atkins, Austin, Bacon, Banks, Biron, Callbeck, Carstairs, Chaput, Christensen, Cochrane, Cook, Cools, Corbin, Cordy, *Day, Doody, Downe, Gauthier, Graham, Harb, Hays, Jaffer, Kelleher, Kinsella, *Kirby, Lapointe, LeBreton, Léger, Losier-Cool, Lynch-Staunton, Maheu, Mahovlich, Mercer, Milne, Moore, Morin, Munson, Murray, *Pearson, Pépin, Phalen, Poulin (Charette), Poy, Prud'homme, Ringuette, Robichaud, Rompkey, Smith, Stratton
PRAYERS
SENATORS' STATEMENTS
Some Honourable Senators made statements.
DAILY ROUTINE OF BUSINESS
Presentation of Petitions
The Honourable Senator Gauthier presented petitions:
Of Residents of the Provinces of Ontario and Quebec with respect to declaring Ottawa officially bilingual.
ORDERS OF THE DAY
GOVERNMENT BUSINESS
Bills
Second reading of Bill C-6, An Act respecting assisted human reproduction and related research.
The Honourable Senator Morin moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Gauthier, that the Bill be read the second time.
After debate,
The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.
The Bill was then read the second time.
The Honourable Senator Morin moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Jaffer, that the Bill be referred to the Standing Senate Committee on Social Affairs, Science and Technology.
The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.
Second reading of Bill C-5, An Act respecting the effective date of the representation order of 2003.
The Honourable Senator Smith, P.C., moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Robichaud, P.C., that the Bill be read the second time.
After debate,
The Honourable Senator Kinsella for the Honourable Senator Lynch-Staunton moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator LeBreton, that further debate on the motion be adjourned until the next sitting.
The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.
Orders No. 1, 4 and 5 were called and postponed until the next sitting.
Motions
Resuming debate on the motion of the Honourable Senator Trenholme Counsell, seconded by the Honourable Senator Massicotte:
That the following Address be presented to Her Excellency the Governor General of Canada:
To Her Excellency the Right Honourable Adrienne Clarkson, Chancellor and Principal Companion of the Order of Canada, Chancellor and Commander of the Order of Military Merit, Chancellor and Commander of the Order of Merit of the Police Forces, Governor General and Commander-in-Chief of Canada.
MAY IT PLEASE YOUR EXCELLENCY:
We, Her Majesty's most loyal and dutiful subjects, the Senate of Canada in Parliament assembled, beg leave to offer our humble thanks to Your Excellency for the gracious Speech which Your Excellency has addressed to both Houses of Parliament.
After debate,
The Honourable Senator LeBreton moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Cochrane, that further debate on the motion be adjourned until the next sitting.
The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.
OTHER BUSINESS
Senate Public Bills
Resuming debate on the motion of the Honourable Senator Kinsella, seconded by the Honourable Senator Stratton, for the second reading of Bill S-7, An Act respecting the effective date of the representation order of 2003,
And on the motion of the Honourable Senator Kinsella, seconded by the Honourable Senator Stratton, that the original question be now put.
After debate,
The Honourable Senator Robichaud, P.C., moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Poy, that further debate on the motion be adjourned until the next sitting.
The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.
Second reading of Bill S-11, An Act to repeal legislation that has not been brought into force within ten years of receiving royal assent.
The Honourable Senator Banks moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Moore, that the Bill be read the second time.
After debate,
The Honourable Senator Banks moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Corbin, that further debate on the motion be adjourned until the next sitting.
The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.
Orders No. 3 to 7 were called and postponed until the next sitting.
Commons Public Bills
The Order was called to resume debate on the motion of the Honourable Senator Joyal, P.C., seconded by the Honourable Senator Kinsella, for the second reading of Bill C-250, An Act to amend the Criminal Code (hate propaganda).
A Point of Order was raised concerning the adjournment of the debate on Bill C-250.
Debate.
SPEAKER'S RULING
I did not think that anything that Senator Banks did was outside of our regular practices. Rule 37(1) provides specifically for what occurred.
When we have an intervention such as a speech, which is provided for in the rule, the normal practice is that the debate is adjourned. It may be adjourned in the name of the same senator, although occasionally it is not, but we have not followed a precise way of doing that. The only issue that I can think of that is a problem here is that Senator Stratton did not use the words, "I move the adjournment of the debate'' but rather said "stand.'' I put words in his mouth, I guess, and perhaps I will take this as an admonition to myself that I must be more careful in the future, and I will try to be.
However, my ruling is that the proceeding that took place is within the rules and, in particular, within the provisions of the rule that Senator Banks used to intervene a second time and that the process that was followed is not out of order.
Orders No. 2 to 4 were called and postponed until the next sitting.
Reports of Committees
Consideration of the First Report of the Standing Committee on Internal Economy, Budgets and Administration (Senate Supplementary Estimates 2003-04 and Senate Estimates 2004-05), presented in the Senate on February 12, 2004.
The Honourable Senator Bacon moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Maheu, that the Report be adopted.
The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.
Consideration of the Second Report of the Standing Committee on Internal Economy, Budgets and Administration (budgets of certain committees), presented in the Senate on February 12, 2004.
The Honourable Senator Bacon moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Prud'homme, P.C., that the Report be adopted.
The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.
Consideration of the Second Report of the Standing Senate Committee on Foreign Affairs (budget—study on Canada-United States and Canada-Mexico trade relationship), presented in the Senate on February 12, 2004.
The Honourable Senator Corbin for the Honourable Senator Stollery moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Banks, that the Report be adopted.
After debate,
The Honourable Senator Rompkey, P.C., moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Losier-Cool, that further debate on the motion be adjourned until the next sitting.
The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.
Other
Order No. 2 (motion) was called and postponed until the next sitting.
Resuming debate on the motion of the Honourable Senator Gauthier, seconded by the Honourable Senator Fraser:
That the Standing Committee on Rules, Procedures and the Rights of Parliament be authorized to examine, for the purposes of reporting by March 1, 2004, all Senate procedure related to the tabling of petitions in this Chamber in Parliament assembled, that a procedural clerk, having examined the form and content, certify the petitions in accordance with established standards and that follow-up be provided for in the Rules of the Senate.
After debate,
In amendment, the Honourable Senator Corbin moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Maheu, that the motion be amended by deleting all the words after the word "That'' and substituting the following therefor:
"the history of the practice in both the Senate and the House of Commons relating to petitions other than petitions for private bills, as well as the customs, conventions and practices of the two Houses at Westminster, be tabled in the Senate and distributed to the honourable senators before being referred to the Standing Committee on Rules, Procedures and the Rights of Parliament.''
After debate,
The Honourable Senator Kinsella moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator LeBreton, that further debate on the motion in amendment be adjourned until the next sitting.
The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.
Resuming debate on the motion of the Honourable Senator Fraser, seconded by the Honourable Senator Joyal, P.C.:
That the Standing Senate Committee on Transport and Communications be authorized to examine and report on the current state of Canadian media industries; emerging trends and developments in these industries; the media's role, rights, and responsibilities in Canadian society; and current and appropriate future policies relating thereto;
That the Committee submit its final report to the Senate no later than Thursday, March 31, 2005; and
That the papers and evidence received and taken on the subject and the work accomplished during the Second Session of the Thirty-seventh Parliament be referred to the Committee.
After debate,
The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.
Orders No. 9 (motion) and 1 (inquiry) were called and postponed until the next sitting.
MOTIONS
The Honourable Senator Banks for the Honourable Senator Forrestall moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Corbin:
That the Standing Senate Committee on National Security and Defence be authorized to examine and report on the need for a national security policy for Canada. In particular, the Committee shall be authorized to examine:
(a) the capability of the Department of National Defence to defend and protect the interests, people and territory of Canada and its ability to respond to or prevent a national emergency or attack and the capability of the Department of Public Safety and Emergency Preparedness to carry out its mandate;
(b) the working relationships between the various agencies involved in intelligence gathering, and how they collect, coordinate, analyze and disseminate information and how these functions might be enhanced;
(c) the mechanisms to review the performance and activities of the various agencies involved in intelligence gathering; and
(d) the security of our borders.
That the papers and evidence received and taken during the First and Second Sessions of the Thirty-seventh Parliament be referred to the Committee;
That the Committee report to the Senate no later than June 30, 2004 and that the Committee retain all powers necessary to publicize the findings of the Committee until July 30, 2004.
The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.
The Honourable Senator Moore for the Honourable Senator Kroft moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Banks:
That the Standing Senate Committee on Banking, Trade and Commerce be authorized to examine and report upon the present state of the domestic and international financial system;
That the papers and evidence received and taken on the subject during the First and Second Sessions of the Thirty- seventh Parliament and any other relevant Parliamentary papers and evidence on the said subject be referred to the Committee; and
That the Committee submit its final report no later than December 31, 2004.
The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.
The Honourable Senator Banks for the Honourable Senator Cordy moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Mahovlich:
That the Standing Senate Committee on National Security and Defence be authorized to permit coverage by electronic media of its public proceedings with the least possible disruption of its hearings.
The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.
The Honourable Senator Banks for the Honourable Senator Cordy moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Poulin:
That the Standing Senate Committee on National Security and Defence have power to engage the services of such counsel and technical, clerical and other personnel as may be necessary for the purpose of its examination and consideration of such bills, subject-matters of bills and estimates as are referred to it.
The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.
The Honourable Senator Christensen for the Honourable Senator Sibbeston moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Léger:
That the Standing Senate Committee on Aboriginal Peoples be empowered to permit coverage by electronic media of its public proceedings with the least possible disruption of its hearings.
The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.
The Honourable Senator Christensen for the Honourable Senator Sibbeston moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Biron:
That the Standing Senate Committee on Aboriginal Peoples have power to engage the services of such counsel and technical, clerical, and other personnel as may be necessary for the purpose of its examination and consideration of such bills, subject-matters of bills and estimates as are referred to it.
The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.
The Honourable Senator Murray, P.C., moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator LeBreton:
That the Standing Senate Committee on National Finance be authorized to examine and report upon the expenditures set out in the Estimates for the fiscal year ending March 31, 2004, with the exception of Parliamentary 10 and Privy Council Vote 25, and
That the papers and evidence received and taken on the subject and the work accomplished by the Standing Senate Committee on National Finance during the Second Session of the Thirty-seventh Parliament be referred to the Committee.
The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.
The Honourable Senator Murray, P.C., moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Kinsella:
That the Standing Senate Committee on National Finance have power to engage the services of such counsel and technical, clerical, and other personnel as may be necessary for the purpose of its examination and consideration of such bills, subject-matters of bills and estimates as are referred to it.
The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.
The Honourable Senator Murray, P.C., moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Jaffer:
That the Standing Senate Committee on National Finance be authorized to permit coverage by electronic media of its public proceedings with the least possible disruption of its hearings.
The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.
The Honourable Senator Milne moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Lapointe:
That the Standing Committee on Rules, Procedures and the Rights of Parliament be authorized to consider a code of conduct for Senators and that all related evidence and papers taken on this issue by the Committee in the 2nd Session of the 37th Parliament be referred to the Committee; and that the Committee be authorized to take into context the 51st Report of the House of Commons Standing Committee on Procedure and House Affairs from the 2nd Session of the 37th Parliament; and that the Committee report no later than April 1, 2004.
The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.
The Honourable Senator Christensen for the Honourable Senator Sibbeston moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Adams:
That the Sixth Report of the Standing Senate Committee on Aboriginal Peoples, tabled in the Senate on October 30, 2003, during the Second Session of the 37th Parliament, be adopted and that, pursuant to Rule 131(2), the Senate request a complete and detailed response from the Government, with the Ministers of Indian Affairs and Northern Development, Justice, Human Resources and Skills Development, Social Development, Canadian Heritage, Public Safety and Emergency Preparedness, Health, and Industry; and the Federal Interlocutor for Métis and Non-status Indians being identified as Ministers responsible for responding to the report.
A Point of Order was raised as to the acceptability of the motion.
After debate,
The Speaker reserved his decision.
The Honourable Senator Banks moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Moore:
That the Standing Senate Committee on Energy, the Environment and Natural Resources have power to engage the services of such counsel and technical, clerical, and other personnel as may be necessary for the purpose of its examination and consideration of such bills, subject-matters of bills and estimates as are referred to it.
The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.
The Honourable Senator Banks moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Adams:
That the Standing Senate Committee on Energy, the Environment and Natural Resources be empowered to permit coverage by electronic media of its public proceedings with the least possible disruption of its hearings.
The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.
The Honourable Senator Chaput moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Ringuette:
That the Standing Senate Committee on Official Languages be empowered to permit coverage by electronic media of its public proceedings with the least possible disruption of its hearings.
The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.
The Honourable Senator Chaput moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Mercer:
That the Standing Senate Committee on Official Languages have power to engage the services of such counsel and technical, clerical, and other personnel as may be necessary for the purpose of its examination and consideration of such bills, subject-matters of bills and estimates as are referred to it.
The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.
The Honourable Senator Kinsella for the Honourable Senator Oliver moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator LeBreton:
That the Standing Senate Committee on Agriculture and Forestry have power to engage the services of such counsel and technical, clerical and other personnel as may be necessary for the purpose of its examination and consideration of such bills, subject matters of bills and estimates as referred to it.
The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.
The Honourable Senator Kinsella for the Honourable Senator Oliver moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator LeBreton:
That the Standing Senate Committee on Agriculture and Forestry be authorized to permit coverage by electronic media of its public proceedings with the least possible disruption of its hearings.
The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.
The Honourable Senator Kinsella for the Honourable Senator Comeau moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator LeBreton:
That Chapter 1, Information Technology; Government On-Line, Chapter 2, Accountability and Ethics in Government; Chapter 3, The Sponsorship Program; and Chapter 4, Advertising Activities, of the November 2003 Report of the Auditor General of Canada to the House of Commons, tabled in the Senate of Canada on February 10, 2004, Sessional Paper No. 3/37-18, be referred to the Standing Senate Committee on National Finance for consideration and report; and
That the Committee submit its final report no later than June 23, 2004.
The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.
The Honourable Senator LeBreton moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Kinsella:
That the Standing Senate Committee on Social Affairs, Science and Technology be authorized to examine and report on issues arising from, and developments since, the tabling of its final report on the state of the health care system in Canada in October 2002. In particular, the Committee shall be authorized to examine issues concerning mental health and mental illness;
That the papers and evidence received and taken by the Committee on the study of mental health and mental illness in Canada in the Second Session of the Thirty-seventh Parliament be referred to the Committee, and
That the Committee submit its final report no later than May 30, 2004.
The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.
The Honourable Senator LeBreton moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Kinsella:
That the Standing Senate Committee on Social Affairs, Science and Technology be authorized to permit coverage by electronic media of its public proceedings with the least possible disruption of its hearings.
The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.
The Honourable Senator Kinsella for the Honourable Senator Beaudoin moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator LeBreton:
That the Standing Senate Committee on Legal and Constitutional Affairs be empowered to permit coverage by electronic media of its public proceedings with the least possible disruption of its hearings.
The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.
The Honourable Senator Kinsella for the Honourable Senator Comeau moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator LeBreton:
That the Senate Standing Committee on Fisheries and Oceans be authorized to examine and report on matters relating to straddling stocks and fish habitat;
That the papers and evidence received and taken on the subject and the work accomplished during the First and Second Sessions of the Thirty-seventh Parliament be referred to the Committee; and
That the Committee submit its final report to the Senate no later than Monday, May 31, 2004.
The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.
The Honourable Senator Kinsella for the Honourable Senator Comeau moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator LeBreton:
That the Senate Standing Committee on Fisheries and Oceans be authorised to examine and report on matters relating to quota allocations and benefits to Nunavut and Nunavik fishermen;
That the papers and evidence received and taken on the subject and the work accomplished during the Second Session of the Thirty-seventh Parliament be referred to the Committee; and
That the Committee submit its final report to the Senate no later than Monday, May 31, 2004.
The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.
The Honourable Senator Kinsella for the Honourable Senator Comeau moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator LeBreton:
That the Standing Senate Committee on Fisheries and Oceans be authorised to permit coverage by electronic media of its public proceedings with the least possible disruption of its hearings.
The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.
The Honourable Senator Kinsella for the Honourable Senator Comeau moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator LeBreton:
That the Standing Senate Committee on Fisheries and Oceans have power to engage the services of such counsel and technical, clerical, and other personnel as may be necessary for the purpose of its examination and consideration of such bills, subject- matters of bills and estimates as are referred to it.
The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.
The Honourable Senator Kinsella for the Honourable Senator Beaudoin moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator LeBreton:
That the Standing Senate Committee on Legal and Constitutional Affairs have power to engage the services of such counsel and technical, clerical, and other personnel as may be necessary for the purpose of its examination and consideration of such bills, subject-matters of bills and estimates as are referred to it.
The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.
With leave,
The Senate reverted to Government Notices of Motions.
With leave of the Senate,
The Honourable Senator Rompkey, P.C., moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Losier-Cool:
That when the Senate adjourns today, it do stand adjourned until Monday, February 16, 2004, at 8:00 p.m.
The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.
REPORTS DEPOSITED WITH THE CLERK OF THE SENATE PURSUANT TO RULE 28(2):
Report of the Canadian International Trade Tribunal entitled "Review of Recommendation Regarding Certain Ring-Spun Yarns'', dated November 3, 2003, pursuant to the Canada-United States Free Trade Agreement Implementation Act, S. C. 1988, c. 65, s. 54.—Sessional Paper No. 3/37-33.
Report of the Canadian International Trade Tribunal entitled "Request for Tariff Relief by C.S. Brooks Inc. Regarding Certain Polyester/Cotton Woven Fabrics'', dated January 21, 2004, pursuant to the Canada-United States Free Trade Agreement Implementation Act, S. C. 1988, c. 65, s. 54.—Sessional Paper No. 3/37-34.
Report of the Canadian International Trade Tribunal entitled "Request for Tariff Relief by Ballin Inc. Regarding Certain Woven Viscose Rayon Fabrics'', dated January 15, 2004, pursuant to the Canada-United States Free Trade Agreement Implementation Act, S. C. 1988, c. 65, s. 54.—Sessional Paper No. 3/37-35.
ADJOURNMENT
The Honourable Senator Rompkey, P.C., moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Losier-Cool:
That the Senate do now adjourn.
The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.
(Accordingly, at 12:02 p.m. the Senate was continued until Monday, February 16, 2004, at 8:00 p.m.)
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Changes in Membership of Committees Pursuant to Rule 85(4)
Standing Committee on Internal Economy, Budgets and Administration
The name of the Honourable Senator Robertson substituted for that of the Honourable Senator Di Nino (February 12).